Discounts - not offered - a new trend

In 2024 Mr Mustard and other experts noted a number of rejections in which enforcement authorities in London stopped offering the discount when issuing official Notices of Rejection which open the door to the independent tribunal.

Motorists often complain that the penalty has doubled and he pedantically points out that is not tree, it simply hasn't halved, it was always £130, £110, £80 or whatever the case may be.

Let us start with a PCN placed on your vehicle.

You can describe the 50% discount as a sweetener, an incentive or a bribe as you like. If you are bang to rights then the discount is worth taking advantage of. It speeds up the process, saves administration costs and time and puts the PCN behind you. The statutory guidance of the Secretary of State requires if a PCN is placed on your car on the 1st of the month and your informal challenge, as it is known, reached the council by the 14th of the month (that is day 14 as the 1st is counted as day 1, a common error is to add 14 not 13) then if that challenge is rejected the 50% discount must be offered again for 14 days. The PCN will also state this.

What has usually happened, as it was easier, is that all informal challenges for at least the first 28 days (and longer if the Notice to Owner was not issued promptly), were met with a templated rejection that offered the discount again for 14 days from receipt of the letter (sometimes the date of the letter) in an attempt to 'get rid' of a PCN. It was a system that worked as most motorists don't have Mr Mustard's staying power.

When the Notice to Owner is issued discounts are officially no longer available. However, for those tougher motorists who make formal representations, which can be identical to the informal challenge, it doesn't matter if the council have said no once already, most councils still offered the discount again for another 14 days.

The reason is simple. Councils would rather have quick money and an easy life. If the motorist starts an Appeal to the independent adjudicator at London Tribunals, as Mr Mustard does for nearly every PCN he fights, the council in question will have to produce the evidence pack containing all of the documents from both sides about the PCN, the traffic order, photos of signs and a written summary of the case. This will take 2 or 3 hours so is expensive. In addition, there is a fee which they have to pay to fund the tribunal setup of c.£30 for each PCN appeal started whether or not it goes ahead and win or lose. Costs are very rare so can largely be ignored.

In 2024 Mr Mustard, and other experts who swap notes and advice, noticed a trend at the formal representations stage (after the Notice to Owner) that the sum demanded in the Notice of Rejection was the 100% figure. They know that many motorists are a bit afraid of the tribunal although they don't need to be, it is an informal forum and therefore rather than doing something new the tendency in the past was to pay up the 50%. Now that some councils are asking for 100% and going to the tribunal doesn't cost the motorist anything except a little time (and from next month your hearing can be on Microsoft Teams so you don't need to go to Chancery Lane) it appears to the experts that there is no incentive to meekly pay up like a mug provided you have at least a bit of an argument (not a load of silly baloney). It will be interesting to see if more Appeals are made in 2025.

This policy change will make no difference to Mr Mustard. He tries to educate his motorists from the off that he tries to find arguments that could work at the tribunal (he is usually only 91% accurate and at least one other expert is more successful) and sets out his stall from the beginning to fight to the end. Sometimes he realises an existing argument will no longer work but picks up a new one along the way so his trip along the high wire can be a bit exciting.

The other point in favour of motorists is that if councils can't keep up with surges in Appeals they sometimes just let them go and cancel the PCN to save time. This is known as the DNC process (Do not contest). Mr Mustard had 54 DNC cases in 2024 (very few from Barnet) across his 300+ cases.

Looking now at moving traffic PCNs for yellow box junctions, banned turns etc there is only one challenge to the council before the tribunal. Again most councils used to always offer the discount again when rejected you but the law does not require them to offer it at all. Moving traffic legislation is quite blunt. If you pay within 14 days of the date on the PCN you can definitely have the discount, otherwise not. If you challenge on day 10 and get rejected on day 20 a council can insist on 100% being paid (or watch you go to Appeal). Many motorists think of these PCNs the same as parking ones as years ago there were mostly parking PCN and not much else but given the wide implementation of 'school streets' and other 'low traffic neighbourhoods' the numbers of these PCNs has mushroomed.

If we finally consider London bus lane PCNs you get sent a PCN and then if still unpaid an Enforcement Notice. Again if you don't pay the PCN within 14 days the discount could be gone. The Enforcement Notice, just like the Notice to Owner in parking, does not include a discount offer. The informal rejection and the Notice of Rejection may include a discount offer but they don't have to (unless the council documents says otherwise in which case out of fairness the offer must be honoured).

Now, finally, to the trend which has been witnessed.

Mr Mustard had a look through recent Notices of Rejection and found that the following councils did not offer the discount as an incentive to pay up rather than start a tribunal Appeal. Mr Mustard started Appeals for them all as he is confident in his arguments.

Enfield

Islington

Camden

Redbridge

Haringey

Brent

Mr Mustard will add other councils to this list as he notices them. It isn't necessarily the case that these councils won't sometimes offer a discount, it may depend how strong they think the case is, a sort of cost benefit analsysis. What Mr Mustard hasn't done is ask any questions about council policy. He will do so when he finds some time.

Mr Mustard's advice is simple. Do all your work at the start and decide if you want to fight or fold. If you want to fight, put all of your energy into it, no half measures.

The end

DVLA - one part of their advice is dangerous & could be expensive

Here follows a standard letter from DVLA

Do not follow the line which Mr Mustard has highlighted in red as if you do not challenge (make representations against) a PCN that you are not the keeper of the vehicle which was given the PCN, but that it is a clone, the PCN will progress though a number of stages and end up with a bailiff.

 

Report the car cloned to the police and the DVLA and challenge every PCN that you receive. You may get a lot of PCNs at the start but you should by reporting the cloning to the police make it too hot to continue to use and then the criminals will stop and move on to another plate.

The end.

 

Enterprise Car Club - why Mr Mustard won't join it

Mr Mustard has helped a few motorists with PCNs after they have rented a car, both from car rental firms and from car clubs, which are sometimes not clubs but commercial outfits calling themselves a club. He has seen administration fees for PCNs which range from the perfectly reasonable £12 to the extortionate £55 but that is a story for another day.

He had a no right turn on Highgate High Street to deal with and he knew it was eminently winnable due to confusing signage but Enterprise Car Club insisted on paying the PCN. Mr Mustard decided to email them about joining (even though he wasn't going to)

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Dear Sirs

I'm not a member yet but your club could be handy sometimes.

I'm worried about if I get a parking PCN. I always fight them as I always park legally.

Your terms imply that I have to pay it

otherwise you will pay it (and the discount period will have passed) and I won't have the chance to fight it & you will add £30 on top.

What policy do you routinely adopt please?

Yours faithfully

---

A reply was received quite quickly, as follows:

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Good afternoon,

Thank you for your email.

If you were to receive a PCN during a reservation with us then you could pay that yourself as you would if it was your own vehicle. Unfortunately if a PCN is given due to your parking at the end of your booking for example. Then because you wouldn’t know about it then we pay it and pass the charge onto your self.

I hope this answers your question.

Kind regards,

Clubhouse Team Member – Enterprise Car Club

---

No mention of making a challenge to the PCN, only information about paying, what if the PCN was given in error?

Also, their website is wrong as parking tickets are the initial legal responsibility of the Owner of the vehicle. There are provisions for car rental companies to pass on the liability (except for bus lanes) by responding to the Notice to Owner for properly documented rentals up to 6 months in duration.

I think that all car rental companies and car clubs (genuine clubs or commercial outfits) should offer the hirer the opportunity to challenge the PCN to the very end if they so wish.

Your legal right to dispute a PCN should not be removed from you by the rental agreement.

Yours frugally

Mr Mustard

Lovely to hear from you DCMD

DCMD (Don't call me Dave) used to write a blog in Barnet before he moved to sunny Essex but he still keeps his beady eye on us.

In response to a recent blog in which Mr Mustard was inciting everyone to rise up and challenge their PCN, DCMD was moved to make a comment which is deserving of some explanation in its own blog. Here is the comment:

The first question to answer is why 150,000+ PCN are issued each year in Barnet. Is it because no-one can get along the roads, pavements, out of their drives or across the road because of badly parked cars? No, it is because the net income from parking is estimated at the beginning of the year and to achieve it that is the number of PCN that need to be issued. It is a classic tail wagging the dog situation.

Mr Mustard's view is that this year's parking surplus should be spent on next year's transport infrastructure projects (like cycle lanes & trams) so that if the number of PCN falls it isn't necessary to have a Parking Recovery Project to make up the lost ground.

What the council should also be doing, in order to achieve their supposed objective of issuing fewer PCN is educating drivers to get it right. The council spend zero on educating people in what is a highly technical area.

It isn't anarchy to suggest that everyone challenges their PCN. It might be a slight over-statement as Mr Mustard finds errors in only 90% of PCN and he does tell 1 in 10 people to pay up at the start. It is the legal right of motorists to make up to 3 challenges against parking PCN; Mr Mustard thinks that the system is designed to take maximum advantage of the apathetic and/or the very busy and he intends to try and encourage them to be less so by explaining the little known process and supplying them with the knowledge they need.

If councils found that issuing 75,000 PCN was more profitable than issuing 150,000 they would issue 75,000.

Yours frugally

Mr Mustard

No, No = Yes

Mr Mustard is persistent and not easily put off.

You need to be the same if you are challenging a PCN.

It is a game of brinkmanship and Mr Mustard will go to the wire because once you have forgotten about the 50% discount you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. You will have read Mr Mustard's guide (top left of the blog if you haven't you naughty reader) and know there are three rounds. Here are the arguments advanced in the three rounds of a recent PCN:

Round 1: informal representations in response to a PCN.

You have issued a PCN for failing to pay in Percy Rd. I have seen a PayByPhone receipt for parking in Percy Road that day, for £1.20. Payment was made for this vehicle at 16:30

Accordingly, the alleged contravention did not occur.

Secondly, the sign in the council's photographs is not authorised for use on its own, only as a sign plate in conjunction with a standard pay-and-display sign. The council has therefore not properly signed the location in accordance with the Secretary of State's authority and may not issue a PCN.

Please cancel the PCN.

Response: The council are not able to cancel your PCN.

Round 2: formal representations in response to a Notice to Owner (they may look familiar: you can quite properly make the same representations as before).

You have issued a PCN for failing to pay in Percy Rd. I have seen a PayByPhone receipt for parking in Percy Road that day, for £1.20. Payment was made for this vehicle at 16:30.

Accordingly, the alleged contravention did not occur.

Secondly, the sign in the council's photographs is not authorised for use on its own, only as a sign plate in conjunction with a standard pay-and-display sign. The council has therefore not properly signed the location in accordance with the Secretary of State's authority and may not issue a PCN.

Please cancel the PCN.

Response: We do not believe it would be appropriate to cancel.

Round 3: filing an Appeal at PATAS (you should be suffering double déjà vu).

You have issued a PCN for failing to pay in Percy Rd. I have seen a PayByPhone receipt for parking in Percy Road that day, for £1.20. Payment was made for this vehicle at 16:30.

Accordingly, the alleged contravention did not occur.

Secondly, the sign in the council's photographs is not authorised for use on its own, only as a sign plate in conjunction with a standard pay-and-display sign. The council has therefore not properly signed the location in accordance with the Secretary of State's authority and may not issue a PCN.

Please cancel the PCN.

Response: The Council has re-examined all of the evidence and on this occasion has decided to not contest your appeal. The PCN has been cancelled due to a processing error.

Is it odd that the processing error was not noticed at rounds 1 & 2?

The challenge that was made at all three stages was the same.

All the council have achieved is wasting £40 on a PATAS Appeal as that is payable as soon as the Appeal is lodged regardless of whether they contest it or throw in the towel as they did in this case.

The PCN was only worth £60 so the council are really out of pocket on this one. They should probably accept all formal representations against lower level (i.e. £60) PCN as otherwise they will; lose money as if half are upheld they have an average income of £30 with a cost of £40 giving a net loss of £10 per PCN. Smart.

So now you know not to be put off by whatever seemingly definite "no" answer the council give you, twice, they may simply be bluffing to try and get you to cough up quietly and they might just throw in the towel when the going gets tough.

Mr Mustard has never yet failed to progress from round 1 to round 3 so when answering his round 2 representations the council should bear in mind that a "no" answer means they will have to write a cheque for £40 and they will almost certainly have zero income to show for it.

Yours frugally

Mr Mustard

N.B. the wrong bay was paid for and the road was the same as was the tariff so although the paid for wrong location is usually a losing argument Mr Mustard was intending to show that the Traffic Management Order had not been breached. He also had another argument he had not previously advanced as a reserve for the day of the hearing (without needing to produce any further evidence).

PCN - retain the discount & gain time to pay

So it is the 1st of the month and you have received a parking ticket or a bus lane contravention. You accept you were in the wrong and want to take advantage of the 50% discount but you are stony broke at the moment. If you pay the amount now you will be short of food or travel to work money. What do you do?

(First of all if the PCN is for parking and sent to you by post you either have to pay the 50% amount within 14 days or the full amount within 28 days. You can slow down the full amount but you lose the chance to pay at a discount.)

The 14 days starts from the date of the PCN and includes the first day, so for a PCN issued on 1 June the 14th day will be the 14 June (i.e. add 13 to the date). You can appeal using the council's computer which is a horrible straitjacket and doesn't give you a copy of your challenge, so Mr Mustard almost never uses it.

You can appeal by post but somehow they can "go missing" so Mr Mustard uses the signed for service to be sure.

Best of all is to use the email method. They don't directly advertise this on the council website or put it on the PCN but do accept representations by this method as that is how all of Mr Mustard's are done. 

The address, which shows on this link, is barnet@nslservices.co.uk

If writing Mr Mustard would wait only until day 10 and then send in your challenge.

If using the on-line system or email he would still only go as far as day 12 or 13 and then send in the challenge.

In theory this freezes the PCN from progressing until the council reply. They try to do this within 14 days but often don't manage to do so. Then they must re-offer the 14 days discount period again. If they don't they have committed a procedural impropriety (otherwise known as a blunder) and then you might as well appeal through the next two stages (in response to the Notice to Owner and after that if rejected to PATAS) which will take another 3 to 6 months and give you more time to pay up should you lose. Do ask Mr Mustard for advice if this happens to you.

If they do offer the discount again then you are most probably into the month of July and got past payday and achieved your objective.

There is always the chance that your challenge will be accepted and the PCN cancelled and then you won't have to pay anything at all. Some recent figures show, although Mr Mustard has asked for them to be looked at again as he thinks they are wrong, that of 1354 initial challenges to PCN in March 14, 252 of those PCN were subsequently cancelled (although not necessarily straight away) so that is about a 1 in 6 chance.

The more that PCN are challenged the less profitable it becomes for the council. Together we can make them behave more reasonably.

Yours frugally

Mr Mustard